ticket quantity controversy

Posted by yamsmos on April 10, 2009 · Under Commentary, Tickets · View Comments 

not since chef morimoto was beaten in the iron chef cook off of 2003 has there been such a dividing controversy as the number of tickets the sounders are making available, or not making available as it were.

as you know, the next 3 games are now sold out, and i bet the next few after that are getting close as well. so the questions in the blogosphere, in comments in the papers, in general fan conversation is this “why does qwest not open up more seats!!!!!!!” some people are quite pissed about it too.

it is a simple enough question, but with not so simple an answer.

first of all, i am a season ticket holder, so you have to take my opinion in light of that… but i am in full support of how the front office are handling this, and here is why.

what this appears to be, is not much more than a basic supply and demand problem. currently, the demand is greater than the supply, and that is a good problem for the party doing the supplying.  you always want more demand for the supply b/c it then results in what we are seeing, games down the road selling out. if none of these games were selling out, people would not be buying in advance knowing that they can then walk up and buy day of.

adrian hanauer noted…

We will weigh our estimated supply and demand, we will consider revenue opportunity, we will consider how this might affect season ticket renewals for next season. There are probably several other factors that different departments within our organization will want to discuss. I would assume that in the very near future… we will have a conversation about this internally.

but, you say, that isn’t happening, they are indeed selling out, so why not open the ~5k more seats that are available then? well these games are not selling out THAT far in advance yet. we just sold out the next three, but is that proof enough that we can continue that pace? some say yes, and some say no. the front office is obviously not 100% convinced that this will continue, so rather than take the risk of creating a situation that i just described, they are taking a bit of wait and see approach.

ok, so lets entertain a scenario where if they opened up the other 5k for the next 3 games that are sold out. would all 5,000 seats sell out? i don’t know if they would, and if they don’t, well you have just given everyone on the fence a reason to NOT buy a ticket down the road. most of the people that WANT to go to sounders games are, or they are buying tickets for future games to ensure that they eventually will. not until you create a buzz about selling out do you get that extra push to sell out.

then there is the whole “value” problem. this is complicated  by the fact that there are better seats and varying prices. if every seat was as good as the next, and every ticket cost the same, then opening up more seats is pretty much a no brainer (other than some internal logistics maybe). but now, if you open up more seats, especially since they are going to be cheaper than most of the rest, it creates a scenario where those people that bought expensive season tickets this year may think… well i will just buy the available cheaper tickets next year on the games i want to go to. i won’t need a season ticket.  i  don’t fall into this category (as i am all but guaranteed to buy for the whole season again next year) and you may not be, but i bet there a lot of people that are.  even if a 1/3 of season ticket holders feel this way, then you could see a significant drop off in season ticket purchases for next year, and then you have a downward spiral of no sell outs and loads of people buying only the day of. now maybe i am being a little dramatic, but this is the exact scenario that the FO want to avoid.

now let me comment on the idea that FO is alienating the fans. there are many people out there saying that the FO is alienating the common fan that want to get into following the sounders but don’t have a chance. well, to that i have to say…. BS. i count about 9 games left that are not sold out at this point in time…. please go buy some tickets to 1 or all of them. you have a chance to go, you just aren’t taking that chance. if every game was sold out, and there were seats that the stadium could easily open, i would agree with you, but that is not the case.  and, if we do get close to selling out every game anywhere in the near future, you can be sure that the FO will open more seats.

another thing i hear is… well, the FO isn’t letting more fans go see the games… let’s see how we react when the team has a stinker of a season. if you are a fan that is talking like that? well, you aren’t a fan. now i know that the attendance numbers will go down during a crap season, i don’t pretend to think that seattle is full of die hard fans that will shell out money no matter what the product on the field is (yes i know that there is a very simple counter argument to this in that team that plays at Safeco), but i don’t have time to listen to that finicky fan who only wants to go if the team is winning. so please stop your talking.

so unless the FO doesn’t open up those remaining 5k seats after all the other games get sold out, well then i really have to agree with how this is being handeled.

oh, and if you didn’t know, the hawks nest will never be open. xbox owns that space and it will remain tarped off as long as they are the sponsor under the current deal.

sorry for the long one. i have read  and re-read it a few times and it isn’t the most eloquent easy read that i have written

now, if you disagree and i haven’t pissed you off too bad, let me know where i am wrong.

OR, you can forget everything i have said and go put a smile on your face by watching this video below…

if this doesn’t put a smile on your face well to you i say, you have no nervous system. heck, you might not even have a soul.

  • GoSounders

    That video makes me giggle like a school girl.

  • Willmore

    How about this. When the team officially sells out its home game, the team opens up the 300 section on one side of the stadium, and sells the tickets for a token price of 1-5$.

    What better way to attract new fans then give them a cheap way of viewing the product? If the team doesn’t sell out a home game, it doesn’t lose anything, but when the team does sell out, it only gains.

    GoSounders Reply:

    The club would most certainly lose- if those people just “want to go to the game” they’re not going to buy a $25, 35, 50, 60+ ticket for a future game.

    DaveS Reply:

    Opening up the 300 section has some huge ramifications.  They would have to pretty much double the staff running the stadium.  That’s a lot of overhead.

  • http://www.worldsoccerdaily.com kent

    i say as soon as they’ve sold out a number of future games, 5~ or more then they open up the lower bowl to the season opener level, 32,523 a palindrome a good sign for all you numerologists

  • Arun

    I am NOT a season ticket holder and I dont have tickets for the next 3 games. But I fully support FOs stance on not opening more seats. In the LOOONG run it will benefit SSFC and its fans (I am talking about 3-4 seasons down the line). Let there be a point when we sell out weeks before even when we are on a bad streak and then we can think about opening up 5000 odd seats behind section 121.

  • madmax

    Management must confess that they don’t want to offend season ticket holders by opening more seats, and take what comes later, it may or may not be good.

  • Taylor

    At the very least they need to open back up the section right behind 116 on the lower bowl.  It was really weird going to the second game and have the whole section from behind me all the way behind the supporters to the other side completely empty. I understand not opening the upper bowl, but just filling the lower bowl should be standard.

  • SoundersFCgal

    I’m sure we can all agree that the FO doesn’t want to turn away folks who can’t get a ticket, but the fact is we all had the same fair chance of buying season tickets from go, and even single game tickets.  The SFC ownership are intelligent people who will do what’s best for all involved.  That’s how they got where they are – by making smart decisions. 

    Thanks for the hysterical video!  I couldn’t stop laughing!!!
    “Sounder ’til I die..!”

  • Casey

    I am worried about the long term future of the Sounders and the MLS.  No doubt there will be interest when the Sounders are playing good and are the “in-thing” as they are right now.  And no doubt for the first few years there will still be interest in this “new team”, but what about 10 years from now?   I´m guessing that it is people who are soccer fans already who have purchased the 22,000 season tickets and are willing to fork out money far in advance for tickets.  It seems to me that people who weren´t currently fans, and want to jump on the band-wagon (as what always happens) won´t be able to experience this amazing phenomenon.  I believe that if more people, especially those not previously interested in soccer and-or the Sounders, are able to experience these magical first games first hand, then we have a chance to create a larger fan base in the long-term future, which can only benefit not only the Sounders but the MLS as a whole. 

  • http://www.byrner.com Gonzo

    heh. … that video … ha …

  • kp

    I agree, the fact more future games are not sold out means they should keep the extra 5K or so seats in reserve.  I also agree having the section behind the southern goal empty is a bummer, the fact we are selling out is great.  Let’s see how the next few weeks go, maybe once we are scored against, or worse lose, the story will be different.  For now (and always) I love rooting for a winning Seattle team with the fan base behind it!!

  • Gary

    I would rather keep the demand in place and see how it plays out the rest of the season and then make a decision for the start of next season based on season ticket renewals.

    Seriously, it would look rather bush league to open up 5k seats and then have to turn around and tarp them again.  Besides, if they up the seating too much, I can’t crack my lovely joke at work… “Hey man, do you have your tickets to this weekend’s SSFC match?  Oh, that’s too bad, because they’re already sold out!  Good thing I have season tickets!”  Oh man I crack myself up!

  • Gary

    omfg I just watched that damn vid!  Is that really the same Germany that almost conquered the world?!?

  • kent

    “Hey man, do you have your tickets to this weekend’s SSFC match?  Oh, that’s too bad, because they’re already sold out!  Good thing I have season tickets!”  Oh man I crack myself up!

    i second that

  • madmax

    The debate is about walk ups, and season ticket holders. Management doesn’t want to open for walk ups. I think they’ll win in the short term, only.

  • madmax

    From some soccer blogs during KC game.
    Some strange things are happening around the Sounders Organization,
    no walk ons to games
    tv blackouts MLS direct and others
    text following of KC game delayed nearly a half hour

    This smells (nose thumbing) similar to when MSN was the only kid on the block. Drew, when can we vote the management out?

  • mike

    the problem w/ MLS and american soccer is that there isn’t a stehplatz (standing section) where the hardcore fans get to stand for the whole game.

    in real soccer leagues, the stehplatz is the fan block, the heart and soul of the team, always being raucuous, singing cheers and local anthems, drinking local beer and having a good time. it’s also the best way to see a game as a newbie.

    general admission bleacher seating, especially @ $16, doesn’t really cut it.

  • madmax

    Sold Out in more ways than one.
    Open letter to Drew Carey,
    Sir I’m dating myself but I remember when US sporting events were for families and children, also. Remember, “hey kids, lets go to the stadium this Sunday”. Are the Sounders trying to create a celebrity atmosphere like the Staples Center? Soccer is the poor man’s game throughout the world. Open some seats on game days. The riff raff will not infect your season ticket holders.

  • SoccerFan

    I’m not a season ticket holder (mainly because my profesional schedule will make me too many games in the summer) but a real soccer and sounders fan and I’m fustrated to not be able to see the game live. The economic argument of the post is good but not relevant for the Sounders. The goal of the front office shouldn’t to get close to sell out crowd at every game but attract as many fan as they can. If they have more people wanting to see the Galaxy game because they know the name, let it be and let them see the game and they will certainly come back for other game. They open another 5k seats and don’t sell out… so what, you still alowed a few more fans to enjoy the game and they will come back.   This is ridiculous, if you have greater demand and more seats available, let people come and enjoy the game.  I’m fustrated by all those sell out games and I don’t think this is good for the Sounders.

  • Ben

    Arun’s points early on were spot on and there’s not much more that needs to be said. This controversy is really about looking 3-4 years from now and seeing how the wrong decision now could impact the club. In 2-3 years is when these choices by Sounders FC should be judged. When Portland and Vancouver join MLS it is a given that demand will go up even more.  I only see them opening up to 35,000-40,000 by then, if ever. Hell, the cathedrals of the EPL only hold 40,000-45,000 and most clubs not in their top 4 don’t sell out. And that’s a 150 year old league.  MLS is 11.

    A successful, sustained growth will be MUCH more important long-term than making a few extra dollars in year one. People running a business (such as this team) have more than just the fans to consider, and all the complainers had ample time to get season tickets, buy singles, or put themselves on a waiting list for next year.  ALL OF THOSE ACTIONS help dictate the business decisions.  Is anyone who is from Seattle (like me) surprised that there are a bunch of bandwagon jumpers complaining now when 3 months ago we know they were making fun of soccer and/or professional sports (ie, the Sonics leaving doesn’t matter because they’re a bunch of spoiled millionaires, who needs a stadium built for them, etc etc)?

    The team management is doing the right thing, and getting us EVERY game on TV (save for US OPEN CUP matches, which aren’t MLS games and always have different venues for the early rounds) was a beautiful thing.  To know I can see every game, even if I can’t go, keeps me from bitching about tickets and capping capacity. But the main point is, the team has to answer to business partners and TV advertisers, EACH of whom bring in more money individually than the collective extra revenue from opening up more seats. It is as important to keep the ratings up on TV as it is to open up more seats. Its more important for the club mgmt to consider what will happen to ticket sales when Freddy Montero leaves for Europe, or if we were to ever miss the playoffs after this hot start. Much bigger things to consider for team management…and all along they know that the complainers are staying interested as they get louder.

    As far as season ticket sales go, the building of a waiting list (for committed buyers of FULL SEASONS – not just the occasional singles buyer like me) is essential. The Seahawks had two periods of long waiting lists for season tickets — back in the Kingdome for a period, and around the 2005 SuperBowl run thru now (I think they still have one).  Back when the first wait list happened, the Seahawks saw their season ticket waiting list carry them past their rare 9-7 playoff push thru a 5 or 6 year period of Dan McGwire and Carlester Crumpler and losing seasons. Had that waiting list not helped keep some seats filled, the Hawks might never have made it to Seahawks Stadium and their second helping of a season ticket waiting list. As Arun said, let’s see us sell out when we miss the playoffs two years straight. With a waiting list, we’ll be fine. Without it, or by opening up more tickets for the fairweathers without requiring a longer term committment to the club, we may be setting ourselves up for disappointment. I see this as a sound, reasoned business strategy by a management team who has made 100% right calls so far.  Why are we questioning a group that has brought us an amazing gift and made all the right decisions so far?

    In my opinion, the prick Howard Shultz could learn a pantload from the marketing team at Sounders FC.

    God I hate Howard Shultz.

  • purplereign

    reminds me of an austin powers scene!!!

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